It should come as a shock to nobody that YU does not have a press release (yet) and there's already a NYT article on the delegation of Cardinals that visited the YU Beit Midrash. With a good chance that the next Pope was in the 'Beis today, someone should have noticed. Anyway, my impressions...
line of the day: by the yeshivish dude to my left: "so it takes a Cardinal to get the Chancellor into the Beis Medrash..."
my observation: the Cardinals were in the 'Beis for literally minutes and nobody rushed them with a knife in one hand and a copy of Beis Yitzchak in the other. Guess a whole bunch of people overreacted.
Elder Sam's funny moment:
Rabbi Blau's joking remark to me about one poor guy who had just made it to YU from ToMo - it was his first day in the place and sure enough, just as they warned him back in Yeshiva, a dozen galachim wander in and start shteigingwas made by a few people during and after the event. Lots of Great Minds really did think alike... Posted by Avraham at January 20, 2004 12:19 AM
"A whole bunch of people" didn't overreact, just Yitz Greenberg.
Posted by: I. at January 20, 2004 02:55 AMThe chancellor's job is to raise money so the lights will shine and you will be able to learn. Show some hakaras hatov.
Posted by: Chance at January 20, 2004 02:26 PMOnce a Philosopher; twice a pervert.
Posted by: J.J. at January 20, 2004 03:37 PMChance: Try to appreciate the humor, even if you don't exactly agree with it. I'm well aware that Dr. Lamm is and has been a frequent participant in the beit midrash, especially considering his workload.
JJ: I don't understand what you mean...?
YU might not have the Press Release ready, but if you look under "News Stories..."
http://communications.yu.edu/articles/article.cfm?id=100538
Posted by: PR at January 21, 2004 12:24 AMMeaning that one could understand the first trip of Cardinal L. to the Bais, as YU is showing the good meshumad around. But the second trip is showing an unhealthy openness to letting people who represent everything that Orthodox Judaism in as partners in dialogue. This is a slippery slope down to inter-Orthodox dialogue which RYBS spent so much time fighting.
Posted by: J.J. at January 21, 2004 09:46 AMahh
let's quote Rav Torah
The Rav asked what is the status of Meshumad? Does he retain complete Kedushas Yisrael or not? On the one hand there are sources in the Gemara that he remains a complete Jew (for instance his Kedushin is valid, see Yevamos 47b). On the other hand, there are other sources that exclude him from various religious tasks (Shechita, Kiesivas Stam and others, see Gittin 45b). (The Rav said that something held him back from saying that a Yisrael Meshumad retained full Kedushsa Yisrael.) Which Kedusha does the Meshumad lose? The Rav said that the inherited Kedusha of a descendant of the patriarchs is irrevocable. However, the Rav felt that a Meshumad forfeited the second Kedusha that is based on the selection of the Jewish nation as the chosen people.
So one could ague that the Rav would support taking a Meshumad to the beis medrash because of that kedusha that he contains.
Posted by: Shaya at January 21, 2004 12:09 PMShaya:
The problems with these guys at YU are too many to list, but a quick trip to a local brothel could solve a couple.
1) Get a sense of humor.
2) Stop being a freaking literalist.
3) Stop thinking that some guy who made up most of his own rules & ideas (except for those he stole from Karl Barth) is the be all and end all of hashkafa. Or, for that matter, in any way normative when it comes to hashkafa.
My point in quoting RYBS is that he set up a system in YU/RIETS and defined the hashkafa of the place, for good or for bad. And part of his rules is that inter-religious dialogue does not take place.
I don't care if you take a meshumad around the Bais Medrash as a private citizen. I do care if you take the freaking Archpishop of Paris along with his whole entourage with reporters snapping pictures away. This no longer makes this a private meeting with a meshumad who wants to learn Gemara (hey there should be more open meshumadim visiting the YU bais medrash) but an open dialogue. And don't say that they were only touring. Because everyone who reads the NYT knows that that is BS.
Posted by: J.J. at January 21, 2004 04:49 PMmy understanding of the rav's rules are the way i was told them of metaphor.
we play baseball
christians play football.
there's no point discussing/defending rules between players of the game, as we are playing 2 different games.
however, if one wanted to work towards a common goal (ensure pensions for all sports players?) that would be ok.
i.e. matter's of dogma (general matters of faith, for us that would include halacha) are off limits, all others are ok.
I fully admit my understanding might be flawed, don't mind be corrected if it is.